| Author | Messages | |
2chucks - 
Spike
 | | 10/11/2007 5:18 PM |
| It looks as though WI might have crossbow hunting for all ages and all abilities sooner than even I thought it might. This push is not coming from the crossbow manufacturers as is typically claimed. It is coming from hunters who want to use the weapon but it not coming from deer hunters. Back in spring, both the WI NWTF and the WI bear hunters voted to seek a rules change that would allow those two species to be hunted with a crossbow by all persons if they so choose.
In WI both of these species can be hunted within there respective seasons with firearms as well as archery gear so these two orgs voted to seek the use of crossbows as well. The Wisconsin Bowhunters Assoc. is opposed to the use of crossbows during archery season for deer and I don't blame them for taking this stance. The issue here is that, turkey hunters enjoy both a spring and fall season, The fall season now runs concurrently with the early archery season for deer. The bear season is also a fall season that runs during archery season for deer. If this request is granted and rules change allowing all persons of all abilities to use a crossbow, You could see turkey hunters and bear hunters hunting with crossbows, right along side bowhunters seeking deer.
I can foresee the potential of this scenario happening. Joe the hunter while using his crossbow is sitting in his tree stand or ground blind with a turkey tag, a bear tag and an archery deer tag in his pocket. While he waits, a deer comes within range so he shoots it and as some hunters do, he leaves the area before trailing the deer. He goes back to his vehicle and retrieves his vertical bow, leaves the crossbow behind and takes up the blood trail. I don't think it is a stretch to think this might happen and the temptation would certainly be their.
If the rules change passes, then I see either a change in dates for the seasons to avoid the overlap or a fast track for the crossbow to be added to the regular deer archery season. | | | |
| AndyC -
4-Pointer
| | 10/11/2007 7:17 PM |
| | Personally I feel that only handicap should be able to use a crossbow. If you want to take part in archery then you should practice up enough to become profecient with the bow. However, with the ever faster speeds of bows I am not sure there is much more skill involved in shooting a bow than a crossbow these days. Crossbows are probably more dangerous than vertical bows also. Once they allow it there will be no going back. | | | |
| Chuckwagon Sam -
| | 10/11/2007 7:43 PM |
| Posted By AndyC on 10/11/2007 7:17 PM
Personally I feel that only handicap should be able to use a crossbow. If you want to take part in archery then you should practice up enough to become profecient with the bow. However, with the ever faster speeds of bows I am not sure there is much more skill involved in shooting a bow than a crossbow these days. Crossbows are probably more dangerous than vertical bows also. Once they allow it there will be no going back.
No one complains or blinks when a gunmaker produces another rifle that will shoot accurately at 1000 yds or a caliber that can blow a deer in half. But bring up the crossbow and it's like fishing for trout with a worm. It's still hunting, and no matter what you put in your hands you must have the skill to locate your quarry and be proficient in your weapons use. Some of the newer compounds shoot faster and flater than most crossbows. So whats the difference.
P.S. I've never used a crossbow and have no desire to.
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| Chuckwagon Sam -
| | 10/11/2007 7:59 PM |
| Posted By 2chucks on 10/11/2007 5:18 PM
It looks as though WI might have crossbow hunting for all ages and all abilities sooner than even I thought it might. This push is not coming from the crossbow manufacturers as is typically claimed. It is coming from hunters who want to use the weapon but it not coming from deer hunters. Back in spring, both the WI NWTF and the WI bear hunters voted to seek a rules change that would allow those two species to be hunted with a crossbow by all persons if they so choose.
In WI both of these species can be hunted within there respective seasons with firearms as well as archery gear so these two orgs voted to seek the use of crossbows as well. The Wisconsin Bowhunters Assoc. is opposed to the use of crossbows during archery season for deer and I don't blame them for taking this stance. The issue here is that, turkey hunters enjoy both a spring and fall season, The fall season now runs concurrently with the early archery season for deer. The bear season is also a fall season that runs during archery season for deer. If this request is granted and rules change allowing all persons of all abilities to use a crossbow, You could see turkey hunters and bear hunters hunting with crossbows, right along side bowhunters seeking deer.
I can foresee the potential of this scenario happening. Joe the hunter while using his crossbow is sitting in his tree stand or ground blind with a turkey tag, a bear tag and an archery deer tag in his pocket. While he waits, a deer comes within range so he shoots it and as some hunters do, he leaves the area before trailing the deer. He goes back to his vehicle and retrieves his vertical bow, leaves the crossbow behind and takes up the blood trail. I don't think it is a stretch to think this might happen and the temptation would certainly be their.
If the rules change passes, then I see either a change in dates for the seasons to avoid the overlap or a fast track for the crossbow to be added to the regular deer archery season.
I agree Ron, give some the opportunity to do what you suggest and some will. We have the same thing here. A doe muzzelloader season starts this Sat. Our archery season is also in. So you know that some will shoot a buck and put their archery tag on it. It will always happen if the opportunity is there regardless of the weapon.
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| AndyC -
4-Pointer
| | 10/11/2007 10:50 PM |
| Posted By Chuckwagon Sam on 10/11/2007 7:43 PM Posted By AndyC on 10/11/2007 7:17 PM
Personally I feel that only handicap should be able to use a crossbow. If you want to take part in archery then you should practice up enough to become profecient with the bow. However, with the ever faster speeds of bows I am not sure there is much more skill involved in shooting a bow than a crossbow these days. Crossbows are probably more dangerous than vertical bows also. Once they allow it there will be no going back.
No one complains or blinks when a gunmaker produces another rifle that will shoot accurately at 1000 yds or a caliber that can blow a deer in half. But bring up the crossbow and it's like fishing for trout with a worm. It's still hunting, and no matter what you put in your hands you must have the skill to locate your quarry and be proficient in your weapons use. Some of the newer compounds shoot faster and flater than most crossbows. So whats the difference.
P.S. I've never used a crossbow and have no desire to.
I agree that some bows are as fast as some crossbows. However, if they legalize crossbows they will soon have a crossbow that shoots 1000 fps or an arrow that is fired not with kenetic energy of a string but with a compressed air. With a big scope you will be able to crossbow a deer at 200 yards. Why can't we just leave good enough alone and say that if you are able bodied then you need to take the time to practice with a bow and become proficent with it. If you are handicap...then you can use a crossbow. I shoot my grandfather crossbow for fun but I would never want to hunt with it....it is heavy and clunky. | | | |
| Chuckwagon Sam -
| | 10/12/2007 8:15 AM |
| Posted By AndyC on 10/11/2007 10:50 PM Posted By Chuckwagon Sam on 10/11/2007 7:43 PM Posted By AndyC on 10/11/2007 7:17 PM
Personally I feel that only handicap should be able to use a crossbow. If you want to take part in archery then you should practice up enough to become profecient with the bow. However, with the ever faster speeds of bows I am not sure there is much more skill involved in shooting a bow than a crossbow these days. Crossbows are probably more dangerous than vertical bows also. Once they allow it there will be no going back.
No one complains or blinks when a gunmaker produces another rifle that will shoot accurately at 1000 yds or a caliber that can blow a deer in half. But bring up the crossbow and it's like fishing for trout with a worm. It's still hunting, and no matter what you put in your hands you must have the skill to locate your quarry and be proficient in your weapons use. Some of the newer compounds shoot faster and flater than most crossbows. So whats the difference.
P.S. I've never used a crossbow and have no desire to.
I agree that some bows are as fast as some crossbows. However, if they legalize crossbows they will soon have a crossbow that shoots 1000 fps or an arrow that is fired not with kenetic energy of a string but with a compressed air. With a big scope you will be able to crossbow a deer at 200 yards. Why can't we just leave good enough alone and say that if you are able bodied then you need to take the time to practice with a bow and become proficent with it. If you are handicap...then you can use a crossbow. I shoot my grandfather crossbow for fun but I would never want to hunt with it....it is heavy and clunky.
Andy,
I agree that they will always try to stretch the limit of a weapons intended purpose. Look at the muzzeloader. From flintlock to the new electric ignition. And the ablity to shoot 300 yds. Trying to push the envelope of the FFL restrictions. Whats going to happen is they''ll end up pushing too far and end up with them falling under federal restrictions and we'll end up having to go thru the gun check process to buy one. But I think, just as Zumbo found out, you can't accept one and exclude another because "you" don't think it's should be used. If there is group of hunters that want a "crossbow season" and there are enough of them, then what makes it any different than those that pushed for in-line muzzeloader seasons. Most states do allow for these different weapons to be used during the regular deer seasons but if there is enough interest and groups like in 2 Chucks area pushing for them, the state agencies try to comply. It's another license fee for them and more tax money coming in from equipment sales. It's up to the state agency to regulate the weapons use and abilities. Here in Pa. we still have a Flintlock only season with very specific restrictions on the gun, keeping it as traditional as possible. I just think that if someone wants a crossbow season they have the right to ask for one. It's up to the state to decide if they'll get one. | | | |
| eubie -
Button Buck
coshocton ohio
| | 10/12/2007 8:28 AM |
| | Andy, why do you think crossbows are more dangerous the verticle bows? | | | |
| tubby -
Record Book
Moundville,Alabama
| | 10/12/2007 1:02 PM |
| I don't think a cross bow gives you a big gain as far as range goes.I had to get one to hunt with because of an injury.To me the crossbow opens doors to the youth,some of the ladies or smaller frame adults not able to draw a conventional compound or recurve.
Why is it more dangerous?If a hunter has been taught safety and respect,the cross bow or the others around the crossbow hunter should be ok,right?
As far as a hunter shooting one with the cross bow and going to get his reg bow before trailing the animal,to me that goes back to ethics.
Just my opinion. | |
Tubby
The God of My Rock;He Is My Sheild;And The Horn Of My Salvation 2 Samuuel,Ch 22 | |
| willy -
8-Pointer
Tenn
| | 10/14/2007 8:49 PM |
| | I agree with tubby there are people in the woods that have no ethics at all and would do just what you said but there are still some good people out there, I can not draw a compound bow due to 2 elbow surgery's and 3 shoulder surgerys | |
Hillbilly Willy
Today is the day the Lord hath made, I will rejoice and be glad in it | |
| willy -
8-Pointer
Tenn
| | 10/14/2007 8:58 PM |
| | and why can't they put restrictions on crossbows just like the flintlock | |
Hillbilly Willy
Today is the day the Lord hath made, I will rejoice and be glad in it | |
| lumberrick -
Spike
| | 10/15/2007 8:20 AM |
| | I'm from Wisconsin, and heres my take on the situation. It is becoming difficult to manage Wisconsins' deer herd. There seems to be an emphasis on finding new ways to reduce the herd. They can create a crossbow season and maybe create a small niche of hunters(kind of a novlety act) but, the problem is still there. The deer herd is out of control in many areas, but in some areas it is under control. So if you open up a crossbow season, you will create added pressure in areas that don't need it, and in areas that do need the herd reduced, there will be no impact act all, because there are already so many opportunitys to shoot a deer with all the other seasons. If the goal is to raise hunter participation to increase deer harvest, this will not work. The biggest problem with Wisconsin IMO is the continued ignorance of the feeding and baiting of deer which keep the herds artificially inflated, raises the potential for the spread of CWD and creates conflict between fellow deer hunters. Eliminate the baiting and feeding and keep to a more traditional hunting season, and quit trying to find new ways to kill deer. I feel the reason for diminishing numbers of hunters is the conflict caused by "baiters and non-baiters" "gun hunters vs. bowhunters" "crossbows vs. vertical etc. etc. bows" | | | |
| tubby -
Record Book
Moundville,Alabama
| | 10/15/2007 11:32 AM |
| I'm not sure if restrctions are the right way to proceed.I'm not sure how the DNR works in Wi,but you are right lumberrick,they need to stop comming up with news ways to kill the deer and concentrate on controlling the deer herds.Here in Alabama,most of the state has open doe days all season long and we are limited to 3 bucks per year.It's been open on does like that for several years now,in an effort to balance our herds here.
In my opinion,we as hunters need to stand together and stop fussing over trival matter such as the ones listed above.
If a person wants to hunt with a gun,bow or cross bow,they should be allowed to do so,as long the hunter conducts himself/herself in a law abideing,safe and ethical manner. | |
Tubby
The God of My Rock;He Is My Sheild;And The Horn Of My Salvation 2 Samuuel,Ch 22 | |
| Chuckwagon Sam -
| | 10/15/2007 6:10 PM |
| | Here in Pa. we have game management areas. They allot so many doe tags per area based on field studies of deer populations. That way they regulate the number of doe killed in an area. Less deer less tags, more deer more tags. We as hunters then choose where we want to hunt and send for tags in that area. | | | |
| AndyC -
4-Pointer
| | 10/15/2007 8:50 PM |
| All I am saying is where does it stop. I think IL has it down pretty good when it comes to archery. If you are disabled you can use a crossbow...if not you better practice up with a bow. However, to be real honest I could care less...I just think it would be more ejoyable and satisfying with a regular compound or recurve.
The muzzeloader thing is getting pretty advanced. T/C's next big innovation in muzzeloader for 2008 is a .50 cal. prepackaged bullet with powder and primer attached. The new gun stores and auto feeds these packets into the gun so that you can have a faster 2nd and 3rd shot without manually reloading through the muzzle. | | | |
| 2chucks -
Spike
| | 10/16/2007 6:54 AM |
| | Well the meeting took place on Saturday between the Wisconsin Bear hunters Assoc, The WI NWTF, the WI Hunters Rights Coalition and the WI bowhunters Assoc. In the end, they agreed to pursue language that is similar to that of some states out West and that is that hunters may use a lesser weapon than what the season allows. If the season allows the use of a gun such as bear and turkey hunting, one would be able to use a crossbow and is already able to use a vertical bow. This would then hold true for the Firearms season and muzzleloader season for deer. This strategy would protect the archery season from crossbows. I think this was a good compromise and satisfies all concerned. | | | |
| MelSue -
Forum Administrator
Record Book
Metamora, Illinois
| | 10/16/2007 7:07 AM |
| | It does sound like a good compromise. I've learned a lot from this thread. | |
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| willy -
8-Pointer
Tenn
| | 10/16/2007 7:54 AM |
| Posted By AndyC on 10/15/2007 8:50 PM
All I am saying is where does it stop. I think IL has it down pretty good when it comes to archery. If you are disabled you can use a crossbow...if not you better practice up with a bow. However, to be real honest I could care less...I just think it would be more ejoyable and satisfying with a regular compound or recurve.
The muzzeloader thing is getting pretty advanced. T/C's next big innovation in muzzeloader for 2008 is a .50 cal. prepackaged bullet with powder and primer attached. The new gun stores and auto feeds these packets into the gun so that you can have a faster 2nd and 3rd shot without manually reloading through the muzzle.
dosen't this new ( muzzleloader by t//c ) defeat the pourpose of muzzleloading ?
in my opinion muzzle load mean's just that !! a gun that HAS to be loaded from the muzzle
and can not be loaded any other way | |
Hillbilly Willy
Today is the day the Lord hath made, I will rejoice and be glad in it | |
| tubby -
Record Book
Moundville,Alabama
| | 10/16/2007 2:34 PM |
| It's getting to the point where technolgy is makeing us argue among one another about what is an acceptable way of hunting and I think it's a real shame.
Is the world getting so lazy that we need muzzle loaders that aren't muzzle loaders ?I'm not saying that one way of hunting is right or better than the other,just that we need let the gun hunters,bow hunters and cross bow hunters each do thier own thing as long as it's legal and ethical. | |
Tubby
The God of My Rock;He Is My Sheild;And The Horn Of My Salvation 2 Samuuel,Ch 22 | |
| cb -
6-Pointer
| | 10/17/2007 8:36 AM |
| | I'm waiting on T/C to make a pump action m/l before I buy a new one.LOL | | | |
| J.Dworek -
Button Buck
Green River,Wyoming
| | 10/19/2007 10:40 PM |
| | Me being a crossbow hunter for the last several year's here in Wyoming,I'am able to hunt with my boy in archery season here,I've had surgrey on both hand's an elbow's an no longer able to pull a bow back.I have to buy a archery tag just like every other bow hunter to,an hunt the same time also in archery season.Here in this state if you wanted to use your crossbow in rifle season there's nothing stopping you it's your preferance,if you wanted to use a muzzleloader in rifle season there's nobody stopping you it's all up to you.In some area's as in the area I hunt elk in ,the rifle season open's half way into are bow season for deer, while I'am hunting elk,you just learn how to adapt to the situation,I've had good sucess in getting my elk every year an a better chance of getting a deer.Oh by the way if your hunting with a bow in a rifle season you must have a garment of orange on while hunting.You know we shouldn't start seperateing are sport because someone doesn't like crossbow's,gun's,muzzleloader's or bow's,all were doing is makeing it easy for the animal right's activist's to single out some indevidual's to go after,as sportsmen we need to stick together,united we stand divided we will fall. | | | |
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